tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16594468.post7575948432653340440..comments2023-10-24T04:29:23.693-06:00Comments on Atheist Ethicist: Speaking of MurderAlonzo Fyfehttp://www.blogger.com/profile/05687777216426347054noreply@blogger.comBlogger10125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16594468.post-34258045724825414492009-06-04T20:37:41.258-06:002009-06-04T20:37:41.258-06:00This and are exactly the sort of activity that I&...<a href="http://crooksandliars.com/david-neiwert/jill-stanek-posts-photos-addresses-t" rel="nofollow">This</a> and <a href="http://thinkprogress.org/2009/06/04/oreilly-coulter-tiller/" rel="nofollow"> are</a> exactly the sort of activity that I'm condemning O'Reilly for in relation to Tiller's death.<br /><br />He's helped promote, mainstream, and normalize/legitimize the hatred that fuels the movement Tiller's killer <a href="http://www.talk2action.org/story/2009/6/3/15219/36560/Front_Page/Beware_the_Lone_Nut_Theory" rel="nofollow">emerged from</a>.Hume's Ghosthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13551684109760430351noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16594468.post-48377379995754530752009-06-04T18:25:02.642-06:002009-06-04T18:25:02.642-06:00'However, it is not sufficient to condemn the ...'However, it is not sufficient to condemn the person who says, "This type of action should be made criminal." Otherwise, one would never be permitted to say, "This type of action should be made criminal."'<br /><br />If someone says being gay should be criminalized, I am certainly going to criticize that view. It doesn't mean that the person isn't permitted to express the view.<br /><br />The point I was making about the AIG video: It doesn't say to kill atheists. It says something about atheists that is based in prejudice and bigotry which could serve to promote violence or persecution of atheists. When I watched the video, my impression was that they were saying that atheists have no morals and your life depends on you and others being Christians because atheists are amoral killers. The person with the gun was supposed to be a Columbine type school killer. I found it also to have a subtext saying an atheist's life is of less value than a Christian's.<br /><br />Demonizing an out-group as a dangerous threat to your in-group has historically predated some of the worst atrocities in human history. What I'm trying to say is that we don't have to wait until someone says "go kill X" to find something morally objectionable and worthy of condemnation in someone else's speech. When hate based violence occurs, it informs the reaons why we condemn such speech in the first place whether or not we can say with 100% certainty that particular speech is responsible for that particular crime.Hume's Ghosthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13551684109760430351noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16594468.post-71598665945554553492009-06-03T11:27:45.807-06:002009-06-03T11:27:45.807-06:00Uneasz:
Our world has millions of examples of peo...Uneasz:<br /><br />Our world has millions of examples of people who decide first what they want to do then, and only then, do they come up with altruistic reasons for their actions -- ones that sound good. Those who are truly motivated to help their fellow man are rare and even fewer are qualified. The naive among us need to believe . . . and most of them can be found in church on Sundays!antonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02909850387414677663noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16594468.post-9323931725545093042009-06-03T10:44:18.415-06:002009-06-03T10:44:18.415-06:00It really could be boiled down to a case of money....<i>It really could be boiled down to a case of money. Abortion doctors, backroom abortionists and head choppers all do it for money.</i><br /><br />What?? That's ludicrous! You don't think there's any motivation to do so because they want to help people? The only reason people become doctors or cops or teachers is for the money? This strikes me as a statement similar to Left Behind's infamous "Sort of like doctors wanting people to be sick or injured so they have something to do"Eneasznoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16594468.post-60284015446600387402009-06-03T08:21:15.855-06:002009-06-03T08:21:15.855-06:00Hi Gang,
First, I don't agree with abortion, a...Hi Gang,<br />First, I don't agree with abortion, and not for religious reasons. With that out of the way, I think there is a need to focus, if there could be a need, on the person "delivering up a fetus to be terminated". <br /><br />Taking a hint from history, it should be noted that hangmen, head choppers, etc. wore hoods or disguises so they could not be identified. They were, in fact, only doing what they were commanded to do by higher powers. They had an unsavory job to do. Society did not attack hangmen.<br /><br />Killing of abortion doctors is yet another example of the ignorance of their killers.<br /><br />It really could be boiled down to a case of money. Abortion doctors, backroom abortionists and head choppers all do it for money.antonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02909850387414677663noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16594468.post-77052860581634854202009-06-03T07:52:44.209-06:002009-06-03T07:52:44.209-06:00Hume's Ghost
If you have a quote from somebod...Hume's Ghost<br /><br />If you have a quote from somebody saying, "Go kill Dr. Tiller" or otherwise advocating private violence, then those people can be legitimately condemned. The right to freedom of speech does not extend to the right to threaten violence.<br /><br />However, it is not sufficient to condemn the person who says, "This type of action should be made criminal." Otherwise, one would never be permitted to say, "This type of action should be made criminal."<br /><br />Even though, "This should be made criminal" explicitly implies the statement "People who do X should be punished."Alonzo Fyfehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05687777216426347054noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16594468.post-41456313466481108072009-06-03T07:21:44.206-06:002009-06-03T07:21:44.206-06:00NAL
Thank you. Correction made.NAL<br /><br />Thank you. Correction made.Alonzo Fyfehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05687777216426347054noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16594468.post-31278290914874823152009-06-03T07:07:51.413-06:002009-06-03T07:07:51.413-06:00This pattern of argument describes the position th...<b>This pattern of argument describes the position that many pro-life advocates seem to take against their pro-life opponents.</b> <br /><br />Shouldn't that sentence be reversed? <br /><br />A thought provoking post.NALhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12244370945682162312noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16594468.post-9346403466618845372009-06-02T22:16:13.351-06:002009-06-02T22:16:13.351-06:00I must also say that I find your position on this ...I must also say that I find your position on this matter and your position on the AIG commericial almost completely at odds.Hume's Ghosthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13551684109760430351noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16594468.post-51998372253779301952009-06-02T22:11:49.344-06:002009-06-02T22:11:49.344-06:00I'll try to make the point again:
Tiller kill...I'll try to make the point again:<br /><br />Tiller killed by someone steeped in extremist rhetoric, derived from an authoritarian, fundamentalist Christian anti-abortion literature.<br /><br />Bill O'Reilly shined a national spotlight on Tiller, giving a platform to leaders from the above movement to denigrate and attack him. O'Reilly himself spread LIES and FALSEHOODS about Tiller's activities.<br /><br />So what am I to do about this. Act as if the latter can't possibly have anything to do with the former.<br /><br />It's intellectually dishonest to recognize a connection between extremism and violence? This is an absurd proposition. Are we to say that the assasination of Rabin in 95 had nothing to do with the religious beliefs of his killer?<br /><br />I have a feeling that I agree with you more than disagree, but am looking at the issue from diffrent meta-levels of analysis.Hume's Ghosthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13551684109760430351noreply@blogger.com