tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16594468.post114429694193674423..comments2023-10-24T04:29:23.693-06:00Comments on Atheist Ethicist: ImmigrationAlonzo Fyfehttp://www.blogger.com/profile/05687777216426347054noreply@blogger.comBlogger5125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16594468.post-1144425511953965912006-04-07T09:58:00.000-06:002006-04-07T09:58:00.000-06:00Not only was George Washington a criminal, but als...Not only was George Washington a criminal, but also a traitor, and if the word had existed then, he'd probably have been described as a terrorist as well. (An interesting thought experiment for my fellow Americans reading this: how would you feel about Washington and about our country if he had actually *been* a terrorist, using terrorist methods to break his country free of British rule? How do you think the rest of the world would feel about him?) Buzzwords distract from reasoned consideration of the issues; they never enhance it.<BR/><BR/>Making a better life for your family is a noble cause in my opinion, just as much as anything Gandhi or Washington or Mandela did (and let's not start on the personal lives of any of those people...) and a long step ahead of many, perhaps even most saints.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16594468.post-1144400246078160012006-04-07T02:57:00.000-06:002006-04-07T02:57:00.000-06:00Anonymous --I think this whole "they're breaking t...Anonymous --<BR/><BR/>I think this whole "they're breaking the law" angle is very much overplayed. Most of the people that come, as far as I can tell, do so because they are deperately poor and need to feed their families. Speeding is against the law, but most people don't villify moderate speeders -- even though speeding is almost never for any important purpose (like feeding one's family). The illegal immigrants may not be saints, but, on the other hand maybe some are -- the fact that they broke the law by sneaking across the border to better their lives does not disqualify them for sainthood.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16594468.post-1144341300792277052006-04-06T10:35:00.000-06:002006-04-06T10:35:00.000-06:00I do not agree with your comparision. We are talki...I do not agree with your comparision. We are talking about 11 million people who illegally entered the country. They did not come for any noble cause. They are not Ghandi, Nelson Mandela or those that protected people who would be burned in ovens. Many of them come to commit crimes suck of the sysytem. Sure many come for jobs but that does not make them saints, they are still breaking the law.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16594468.post-1144324382414248682006-04-06T05:53:00.000-06:002006-04-06T05:53:00.000-06:00The idea that the analogy does not work because in...The idea that the analogy does not work because interstate immigration is legal and much international immigration is illegal begs the question.<BR/><BR/>Illegal immigrants are criminals. However, those who hid Jews in their attic in NAZI Germany, or who helped slaves to escape to Canada before the Civil War, or those who engage in sodomy in most states in this country are criminals as well.<BR/><BR/>Anybody in Afghanistan who converts from Islam is a criminal, and certainly every person who signed the Declaration of Independence or fought in George Washington's army was a criminal.<BR/><BR/>Those who engaged in civil disobedience to end segretation in this country were criminals.<BR/><BR/>Ghandi was a criminal, as was Nelson Mandella.<BR/><BR/>In discussing morality, the first question can never be whether a person is or is not a criminal. The question is whether his actions ought or ought not to have been made illegal.Alonzo Fyfehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05687777216426347054noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16594468.post-1144321352947767302006-04-06T05:02:00.000-06:002006-04-06T05:02:00.000-06:00The issue with most people (Pat Buchanan types asi...The issue with most people (Pat Buchanan types aside) is not all immigration but illegal immigration. This is an important distinction because, by definition, these people are criminals.<BR/><BR/>I'm afraid there is no parallel between interstate migration and the international kind since transport between states is a protected right and there is no such thing as legal citizenship of a state; just the overarching US citizenship we all have in common (just living in a state is enough, given US citizenship).<BR/><BR/>For fun, here is my proposal (it's far too radical to ever make it):<BR/>1. Arrest and deport illegals as we find them.<BR/>2. Establish an unlimited quota on all immigrants - require only a security check.<BR/>3. Eliminate all state benefits for non-citizens (at least!)Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com